Art and Drug Influences

[Nelson_H]

One thing about steroids (and maybe Psychedelics too). once you start taking them, you will never really know how far you can push your natural human potential.

I take steroids, not the muscle-building kind, to keep me alive when my lung disease comes back every few years. It changes me each time. it takes months for me to return to my normal.

 

[JStarr]

People make crap without drugs all the time. And if you're going to say that artists taking drugs are equivalent to athletes taking steroids, I guess you can also count out all prescription steroids and other life-saving medications. Everything you put into your body can "alter" your mind in some way. Also, "recreational" drugs have a temporary effect. They wear off, so you'd have to constantly be under the influence while creating art, or need to be on drugs to make your work so that it turns out in the druggy style you need it to be. I know someone like that and his art looks like everyone else's who takes acid--what you would expect. Yuck.

Isn't that what many musicians end up doing?

And then, they die.

Although Keith Richards is beating the odds: https://www.quora.com/How-come-people-make-fun-about-Keith-Richards-being-alive/answer/Jae-Starr

 

[stlukesguild]

artyczar- I hung one at a coffee house once and a couple of weeks later, the owner told me to come take it down because certain people were offended. Granted, it was a couple engaged in a sexual act, but it was fairly abstracted. I didn't understand it at the time, but in today's landscape, I don't think he would have let me hang it in the first place despite how abstracted it was.

Yes, our current political landscape makes nudity in art increasingly difficult to display. One artist I have followed for some years, Suzy Smith, creates paintings inspired by classic 1950s pinups, and Pop Artists including Wayne Thiebaud, Tom Wesselmann, and Mel Ramos has shifted away from nudes in the last few years because of the difficulty in getting these shown.

Not long ago, the Belgian Bureau of Culture or Tourism produced a tongue-in-cheek video about censorship in social media in response to the fact that Peter Paul Rubens had become the most censored artist on social media. Insanely, the 16th century was more accepting of nudity in art than the 21st!

I've always been struck by the fact that no one questions why an artist chooses to paint flowers, or fruit, or bunny rabbits, or landscapes, or just about anything besides the nude. There was an interview with a collector of contemporary nudes and pinups, Howard Tullman, that I read some time ago. His collection includes paintings by Suzy Smith. The interviewer asked, what sort of people paint nudes? The collector laughed and pointed out that Suzy Smith, for example, would make you think of a conservative 60+ year-old school teacher rather than a sexual deviant.

 

[JStarr]

One thing about steroids (and maybe Psychedelics too). once you start taking them, you will never really know how far you can push your natural human potential.

I take steroids, not the muscle-building kind, to keep me alive when my lung disease comes back every few years. It changes me each time. it takes months for me to return to my normal.

ummmm.... this makes no sense to me.

It is like saying if a human eats organ meats (which are terrific for repairing muscle- such as would show minuscule tears after a workout) that isn't allowing the human to "know how far [he] can push his natural human potential."

Makes no sense. As if, eating enough calories in the first place is "natural", but over- or under- eating same is not.

Steroids can be nasty supplements, but they *do* have uses. Your lung disease. A friend's inflammation from old injuries. Growing muscle tissue.

So why is eating organ meats fine, taking iron supplements okay, drinking disgusting protein shakes instead of eating oatmeal, but taking steroids is "unnatural"?

(corticosteroid and anabolic steroids are different, but the effects overlap quite a bit)

 

[Artyczar]

Isn't that what many musicians end up doing?

And then, they die.

Although Keith Richards is beating the odds: https://www.quora.com/How-come-people-make-fun-about-Keith-Richards-being-alive/answer/Jae-Starr

Did you write that? That's pretty funny. Why is he still going??? Some people have all the luck I guess.

 

[Artyczar]

I too need to take steroids for having an autoimmune disorder. It builds "muscle" in ....my belly!

 

[Nelson_H]

Did you write that? That's pretty funny. Why is he still going??? Some people have all the luck I guess.

Ozzy Osbourne is writing a health advice column for the Sunday Times magazine, associated with London's Times newspaper.
After all the drugs and bad lifestyle, he is still alive. He must know something.

 

[Artyczar]

Ozzy Osbourne is writing a health advice column for the Sunday Times magazine, associated with London's Times newspaper.
After all the drugs and bad lifestyle, he is still alive. He must know something.

Ozzy, now there's a brain-damaged person from too many drugs. Too much of anything can kill you, or nearly kill you. Even water.

 

[Nelson_H]

in body building there are two divisions (oversimplified) one does drug testing the other is a free-for-all.

Maybe we should have little stickers for "I Used drugs to paint this!". or "I did not use drugs to paint this."
At your gallery showing, you have to pee in a cup.

 

[Nelson_H]

ummmm.... this makes no sense to me.

It is like saying if a human eats organ meats (which are terrific for repairing muscle- such as would show minuscule tears after a workout) that isn't allowing the human to "know how far [he] can push his natural human potential."

Makes no sense. As if, eating enough calories in the first place is "natural", but over- or under- eating same is not.

Steroids can be nasty supplements, but they *do* have uses. Your lung disease. A friend's inflammation from old injuries. Growing muscle tissue.

So why is eating organ meats fine, taking iron supplements okay, drinking disgusting protein shakes instead of eating oatmeal, but taking steroids is "unnatural"?

(corticosteroid and anabolic steroids are different, but the effects overlap quite a bit)

I take Prednisone ( a corticosteroid) which destroys muscle. It reduces the swelling in my lungs so they move. Luckily it had been 2 years since my last attack. I may go 10 years before the next one.

I had a really bad attack in 2015. I was on high doses of Prednisone for over 6 months. it destroyed my health. my weight was over 340 pounds and I could barely walk. I was pre-diabetic. and I was being tested for early-onset dementia. I was only 50 at the time.
I joined a fitness program at the gym. I thought it was going to kill me. I told myself, I would stick it out until my heart exploded.
I lost 100 pounds, and all my health problems disappeared. My doctor was in shock.
I gained some back over covid. and my stomach surgery. But I am working on losing that and more.

d more.

 

[JStarr]

Glad you're in a remission phase; breathing makes all of life much easier.

There is some overlap in effects/side-effects between corticosteroid and anabolic steriods; they are not 'the same', but the same way all SSRIs allow more serotonin to float around and between neurons in the brain, steroids have some side effects in common

-Corticosteroids: Short-term use can cause weight gain, puffy face, nausea, mood swings, and trouble sleeping. You might also get thinner skin, acne, unusual hair growth, and spikes in blood sugar and blood pressure.

-Anabolic: These steroids can cause bad acne and fluid retention. Long-term use can stop the body from making testosterone. In men, this causes smaller testicles, lower sperm counts, infertility, and breast growth. Women may have male-pattern baldness, facial hair growth, mood changes, periods that change or stop, and a deeper voice.

There's overlap- because the chemical formula of a steroid is at its base the same. I think most folks are aware there's a difference in the usual-suspect uses of the two different types of well-known steroids, what I am curious about is why it is believed using anabolic steroids to increase muscle mass and strength is somehow short-changing the athlete, but using corticosteroids to, oh, decrease inflammation from muscle tears and joint sprains from working out, isn't? It isn't as if corticosteroids are without harmful side effects, as you have explained- even if they are taken to mitigate what may be even more harmful conditions.

That just doesn't make sense to me. It seems to me like carving out a particular space for something most folks think is wrong without ever demonstrating why it is wrong.

 

[Nelson_H]

Glad you're in a remission phase; breathing makes all of life much easier.

There is some overlap in effects/side-effects between corticosteroid and anabolic steriods; they are not 'the same', but the same way all SSRIs allow more serotonin to float around and between neurons in the brain, steroids have some side effects in common

-Corticosteroids: Short-term use can cause weight gain, puffy face, nausea, mood swings, and trouble sleeping. You might also get thinner skin, acne, unusual hair growth, and spikes in blood sugar and blood pressure.

-Anabolic: These steroids can cause bad acne and fluid retention. Long-term use can stop the body from making testosterone. In men, this causes smaller testicles, lower sperm counts, infertility, and breast growth. Women may have male-pattern baldness, facial hair growth, mood changes, periods that change or stop, and a deeper voice.

There's overlap- because the chemical formula of a steroid is at its base the same. I think most folks are aware there's a difference in the usual-suspect uses of the two different types of well-known steroids, what I am curious about is why it is believed using anabolic steroids to increase muscle mass and strength is somehow short-changing the athlete, but using corticosteroids to, oh, decrease inflammation from muscle tears and joint sprains from working out, isn't? It isn't as if corticosteroids are without harmful side effects, as you have explained- even if they are taken to mitigate what may be even more harmful conditions.

That just doesn't make sense to me. It seems to me like carving out a particular space for something most folks think is wrong without ever demonstrating why it is wrong.

Corticosteroids also atrophy muscle. I got really weak. could not lift myself out of bed. had to just roll off after a while. The weight gain is also from the vampire like hunger. it is crazy. The mood swings were bad.

 

[JStarr]

Corticosteroids also atrophy muscle. I got really weak. could not lift myself out of bed. had to just roll off after a while. The weight gain is also from the vampire like hunger. it is crazy. The mood swings were bad.

Your remission length seems promising, and, do you know your triggers? That helps a lot doesn't it? Of course, the weight loss and extra moving about is terrific for you; it's so very hard to do with any disability and too many people give up. Glad you've not.

I had a R-side CVA, 1.5cm bright spot on the right posterior basal ganglia- the little organ that says "Go!" I lost a bunch of odd bits and pieces of muscles on the left side and still sometimes walk like Igor, but if I concentrate, I can roll my foot with the best of them. Problem is, concentrating then causes cramps in the left hip and thigh- can't win for losing.

So I do my best, and sit when I must.

Congratulations to you.

 

[Nelson_H]

Your remission length seems promising, and, do you know your triggers? That helps a lot doesn't it? Of course, the weight loss and extra moving about is terrific for you; it's so very hard to do with any disability and too many people give up. Glad you've not.

I had a R-side CVA, 1.5cm bright spot on the right posterior basal ganglia- the little organ that says "Go!" I lost a bunch of odd bits and pieces of muscles on the left side and still sometimes walk like Igor, but if I concentrate, I can roll my foot with the best of them. Problem is, concentrating then causes cramps in the left hip and thigh- can't win for losing.

So I do my best, and sit when I must.

Congratulations to you.

I developed sarcoidosis when I was 40. It got into my heart and lungs. they remove the sack around my heart. My lungs swell up when I have an attack. sarcoidosis normally does not come back.
The healthier I am, the less chance of it coming back. and I recovered a lot faster this time. it came back in the middle of covid. That was 6 years after my last attack.

It pushes me to stay healthy and exercise. Overall, the disease is a pain in the bum but also has had a positive impact on my lifestyle.

 

[Enyaw]

Good on you Cranberry. It would have killed many but you are still ticking.

 

[Artyczar]

It's good to be motivated to stay healthy! Sometimes, I find that part difficult. Having a couple of autoimmune disorders that keep me fatigued a good part of the time can make that hard, plus I have mental illness. The medications help, as does therapy, but it's never a cure-all, nor are the medications for lupus and all the physical issues that come with that. One has to be super proactive (almost at all times) in order to barely stay healthy while balancing stress, where stress is enemy number one. It can be daunting, and motivation is difficult to find at times. It hides under the bed and I forget to look there.