What Are You Listening To?

[brianvds]

All true - there is not really any lasting national character to music. I was thinking more specifically of a generation of French composers that were trying to escape the looming shadow of Wagner. Some started as avid fans (Debussy comes to mind), but many eventually rejected his aesthetic, and came up with their own unique thing.

Yes. Wagner was a towering figure not merely in music but throughout the whole of the Arts. Baudelaire, Verlaine, Oscar Wilde, Proust, Odilon Redon, Moreau, Dore, etc... were all profoundly influenced by Wagner... to say nothing of Wagner, Tchaikovsky, Richard Strauss, Debussy, Schoenberg, etc... Wagnerian sound and ideas (especially the leitmotif) still dominate film scores. He was like Picasso... a figure you had to get over or around... but couldn't really ignore. The visual arts seem to have been able to get around Wagner and High Romanticism and Post-Romanticism thanks to the strength of the Impressionists.

And here I thought I was doing a great job of ignoring Wagner. But apparently, one cannot watch Lord of the Rings without running into this particular Dark Lord all over the score...

 

[stlukesguild]

He's all over John Williams. Along with Holst. Mars from The Planets was definitely a model for the Imperial March in Star Wars.

 

[stlukesguild]

Wagner's Influence on Film Score's

How Wagner Shaped Hollywood

 

[stlukesguild]

No articles on Brahms' influence on film scores.

 

[brianvds]

No articles on Brahms' influence on film scores.

He'd probably be mightily relieved to hear that.

 

[stlukesguild]

He was a curmudgeon. Wagner would love his status as a composer for theater and someone not shy when it comes to ego.

 

[Artyczar]

We should call this the Wagner forum and make a new thread for music.

 

[stlukesguild]

Actually, I haven't listened to Wagner for quite some time. Tristan und Isolde and Parsifal were the first two operas I ever listened to, taking the LPs out of the library when I was maybe 16. Honestly, I think I just liked the covers. It's surprising that I liked them considering that neither are among the more accessible operas such as The Magic Flute, Carmen, or La Traviata. Both recordings were by Herbert von Karajan. I love Carlos Kleiber. His T&I is certainly among the finest and his 5th Symphony by Beethoven is unrivaled... but Karajan's recording with the Berlin Philharmonic is other-worldly... refined to the point of polished steel. Unfortunately, Spotify doesn't have that recording so I'll need to listen to it in my studio on the CD player.

Luckily YouTube has Karajan's Prelude:

In spite of his reputation for over-the-top bombast, Wagner is often quite lyrical and lush... as in the Prelude.

Comically, the other opera I picked up from the library at the same time was as far from Wagner... or almost any traditional opera... as possible: Philip Glass' Einstein on the Beach:

 

[stlukesguild]

Let's continue in the Romantic direction. I've long loved Sir John Barbirolli's recording of Mahler's 5th above any other... but let's give a listen to the recent and highly-praised recording by Osmo Vanska. If this recording had been in the library back in the day I would certainly have taken it out. Just look at the gorgeous cover with all those fractals!

Unfortunately, no Vanska recording of the 5th on YouTube... but there is Karajan:

 

[Iain]

Speaking of classical on YT, it was either the 5th, or possibly Brahms 2nd or 3rd, but i was shocked at the clarity of the orchestra on YT compared to the CD I was familiar with. Why, they are both recordings.

 

[stlukesguild]

The same recording? Same orchestra? Same year? The sound quality can vary greatly between recordings of the same work.

 

[stlukesguild]

Speaking of sound quality... the Vanska recording of Mahler's 5th sounds spectacular... and I wouldn't expect less on BIS records. The performance is also every bit worthy of the praise it has received.

 

[Hermes2020]

Speaking of sound quality... the Vanska recording of Mahler's 5th sounds spectacular... and I wouldn't expect less on BIS records. The performance is also every bit worthy of the praise it has received.

Yes, I have that recording, as well as some other Vanska recordings of Mahler with the same orchestra, and agree with you about the sound. I would love to hear a version of Das Lied von der Erde conducted by him.

 

[stlukesguild]

Yes, I have that recording, as well as some other Vanska recordings of Mahler with the same orchestra, and agree with you about the sound. I would love to hear a version of Das Lied von der Erde conducted by him.

The challenge there would be to get vocalists to rival some of the finest recordings from the past: Christa Ludwig, Fritz Wunderlich, Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau, Kathleen Ferrier, Maureen Forrester, Janet Baker, etc... What might be interesting would be recordings with counter-tenors. We are not living in the greatest age for traditional operatic singers... but we are in the golden age of counter-tenors.

 

[brianvds]

We should call this the Wagner forum and make a new thread for music.

Some folks here apparently think Wagner is synonymous with music. I will not rest until we have turned it into a Brahms thread.

 

[stlukesguild]

Brahms!? Brahms!? We all know that Bach is the God of Music!! And since it's Sunday it is time for some dutiful worship:

 

[stlukesguild]

Andràs Schiff's second recording of the WTC has been my "go to" version for some time now. His first recording was one of my 2 or 3 favorites prior. There are many good versions. Some, like Sviatoslav Richter's, are a bit too Romantic for my taste for Bach. After Schiff, my favorites are those by Angela Hewitt (which is sadly unavailable on Spotify), Glenn Gould (or course), and Ralph Kirkpatrick played on the clavichord. The WTC was scored for keyboard but the term "clavier" does not name a specific instrument... merely a keyboard instrument, especially one with strings. It is assumed that Bach meant a harpsichord which was the primary keyboard instrument of his time and some purists insist upon playing the WTC on the harpsichord. I've never been fond of extended works for solo harpsichord. It might also be noted that the clavichord, played by Kirkpatrick, may have been just as much Bach's instrument of choice... especially for a work composed to be played at home as a teaching tool for his children in an intimate setting. But let's be realistic, if we insist on being purists, Beethoven's Piano Concerto 5 (Emperor) as well as most of his later piano sonatas should be performed on a piano-forte rather than a modern Grand Piano... which would sound ridiculous.

 

[stlukesguild]

 

[musket]

We watched a documentary called Score last night, about movie music; interviews with numerous composers, techs etc.

It's truly impressive, what goes into the making of a modern film score. The thing is, for all that it's amazing, it's essentially made, nine times out of ten, to add weight to a piece of drek. I mean seriously, millions and millions of dollars spent on the score of Transformers: Age of Extinction, or Mission Impossible: Rogue Nation? This is music meant to yank your jaded senses into feeling emotions about cardboard superheroes and giant robots.

Of course Wagner had a huge influence on this. Wallowing in emotions was what he was all about. No wonder Hitler, a true master of emotional manipulation, loved him.

 

[stlukesguild]

This box set remains one of the best buys I ever made for classical music. I the time I purchased it it was selling on Amazon for $20... less than $1 per disc. The set contains the brilliant recordings by John Eliot Gardiner and the English Baroque Soloists and Monteverdi Choir and soloists of Bach's major choral works: The Christmas Oratorio, The Mass in B-minor, The St. Matthew Passion, The St. John Passion, and the Magnificat. The set also includes 12 discs of Bach's finest cantatas from earlier recordings by Gardiner before his more recent live recordings of Bach's entire cantatas. The cantatas contain an almost unfathomable wealth of great music: gorgeous instrumental passages, stirring choral selections, beautiful vocal selection paired with a great variety of solo instruments and ensembles... soloists, duets, trios, etc...

Today's listening included: cantatas BWV 140, 147, and 106... three of the finest and certainly three of my favorite works... as well as BWV 106... another fine work.