Pastel on cardboard?

[MurrayG]

Hi Folks. I know I am a bit out there, but here goes. Has anyone tried to paint with pastels on corrugated cardboard, the normal packing box stuff.
I cannot get large sheets of anything easily, the online orders are a bit wonky here. I just fiddled with some pastels on an offcut and it wasn't soooo bad. The corrugations come through at times. AND yes, it's not archival, but that's the same as with Degas work on cardboard, though it was not the corrugated type . I ask partly as I would like to try a larger painting, my only option is watercolour paper in an A1 sheet, but again I don't have ready access to gessos or primers. The homemade stuff (talc, PVA and acrylic paint) I tried worked but the tooth was limited and the harder pastels started skating pretty quickly. It's a hassle as any online order delivery costs as much as the object making it VERY expensive, plus I've had some problems receiving. Thanks all.

 

[Donna T]

I'm so sorry you can't get the materials you need, Murray. Your work is deserving of the best supports. Unless you can find some kind of cardboard that is acid-free I'd be hesitant for you to work on it because it would probably degrade quickly. I'm guessing the pastels by Degas on cardboard are kept under very strict conditions to try to preserve them. Can you get the matte variety of acrylic paint? I had some luck with that when it became clear that painting on regular acrylic with pastels was not possible. What about marble dust or pumice powder? Any way to get those?

 

[Hermes2020]

I agree with Donna. Instead of using cardboard, could you get hold of hardboard? Wherever you are, I'm pretty sure that you should be able to get hold of some kind of universal primer to prepare the hardboard. My guess is that even medium quality white household paint from a hardware store on hardboard will be more durable than cardboard.

 

[MurrayG]

Hi Donna and Hermes, Yes, I agree that the cardboard is not really up to it, the corrugations also are limiting. Hardboard or MDF is an option, I would need to find a primer for the pastels. If I painted with acrylic, no problem. It#s the tooth for the pastels that I have issues with. I'm now just so "into " pastels I will go on a hunt for courser powders. There are heaps of marble stone workers near Split, maybe I can try their sawdust as many other grits just are not around... Thanks

 

[Donna T]

Maybe the stone workers will be curious about an artist needing some grit and be willing to help you. Fingers crossed!

 

[Jo Castillo]

You can also use sandpaper from the hardware store in a fine grit. I also used pumice with acrylic medium, but paint would be the same if you get the mix right on masonite board. Just realized boards are very expensive at the moment. You could paint the cardboard.

 

[P. Barrie]

The marble stone works sounds like a real good place to look into for the dust. Mix it with a good 100% acrylic flat paint and you pretty much have gesso. Be careful when handling/ mixing the dust, it can be irritating to lungs and respiratory passages.
I‘ve gessoed hardboard and used pastel on it. Found I had to use matte fixative between layers and I don’t layer that much.
perhaps you could use that gesso on a heavy weight/weave canvas, after glued to panel or stretched?

 

[MurrayG]

Hi Jo and PB. It will be a few days before I can get to the stone workers but will try that. I agree that fine sandpaper could work, but I'm looking for a large format and it may not be "archival". Not that is a major concern, but a good surface is. I can get MDF board cheapish until prices go crazy. The canvass might also work if I support it on say cardboard. I will ask some locals as they may know somewhere that has super fine grit/Toxide etc. Funny how things are never so straight forward... Ah well.

 

[Hermes2020]

When I visited Split it seemed to be the kind of place that would have a big community of artists, so I'm surprised that there aren't many suppliers of artist's materials. Could it be a business opportunity?

 

[ntl]

IIRC, some corrugated cardboard has a heavy paper covering, which probably would not show the lines when painted. Ask about appliance boxes--esp stoves--I seem to remember being given a stove box a few years ago. The fellow at HD told me I hit him at just the right time-they're taken out of the store as soon as the appliance is removed from the box. He pulled it out of the cart filled with a few other boxes for me. I remember it being an extremely heavy box with a hard surface. (Maybe it's time for a new stove? ) Other appliances or electronics may come in such sturdy boxes--microwaves, washers, etc...

 

[stlukesguild]

Try priming the cardboard with a matte acrylic. These will give you a good tooth. I work with these as primers myself.

 

[MurrayG]

Hi ntl and Stluke. Thanks. Funny, like Hermes said, Split has a good artistic community, I'm not really involved tho. They use a lot of acrylic. The supplies in Split are not large so I dont know where they get material from. Acrylic primer everywhere (cheap stuff) that is OK for painting. very little gesso. I think people make their own as cost is everything here. I will see if I can get some grit and make a "gesso". I have some old cotton sheets that I can put on a support (Card maybe) and will look to applying a gesso AND dusting the surface to get closer to a "pastelmat" type surface. Looks like a project in patience.

 

[stlukesguild]

It has become more difficult for me to find supplies recently as the main discount art supplier here was bought out and then mothballed by Michaels which is far more expensive and limited with regard to art materials. Their focus is really upon amateur crafters. I have found one solid art material supplier... all the way on the other side of town. I've begun purchasing some materials through online sites. Even Amazon.com doesn't have some of the materials I need... and some that they do is way overpriced. But I guess artists have always learned to make do with the materials that they have access to. If they didn't have marble, they'd use limestone or wood.

 

[Bartc]

Murray, as I recall, I found interesting copper enamel paintings in Split as well as the more traditional Croatian reverse glass painting.

St. Lukes, Amazon has long past being inexpensive. You are better off ordering from one of the big online true art retailers when they have sales, like Blick, Jerry's, Cheap Joe's, etc. Michael's is exactly as you characterized them: craft supplier mostly.

 

[chaffee2]

Hey Murray,...not sure where you are with your cardboard quest, but as I just read through the thread it occurred to me that any supermarket typically has a wide variety of cardboard densities, sizes and textures that are sent out for recycle. I'd imagine you could get a peek at some of it and take what you want, could be a goldmine for your endeavors(?)....all mistakes are recyclable